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Joefnh
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Food Intolerances : Gluten, Soy, Dairy, Onions
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polly I have to agree with you on the paleo diet. I have been eating more or less a paleo diet and found that it did help me quite quickly. Besides the bit of rice, I have been eating paleo and found it worked well.. I am hoping with the MRT / LEAP diet that I can adapt that to the paleo like diet to continue the process of healing.

--Joe
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TooManyHats
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Food Intolerances : Gluten Soy Dairy Spices including cinnamon, cloves, and ginger
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm just wondering whether the baking soda and baking powder cause some kind of chemical reaction with all the "safe" ingredients that are used in the baked goods making them into something your system no longer recognizes or is willing to tolerate? Just my thoughts over the last few days on this thread.
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sarkin
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polly, thank you so much for this. Believe it or not, during the "wheat-free vegan" experiment in Feb., I came across the Paleo diet and was very interested. I read Cordain's site, and another fellow's, and its simplicity and evolutionary reasoning (though of course speculative) had a lot of appeal. I mentioned to my husband - yes, that loyal companion who followed me willingly into 'GF vegan' - but I couldn't bring myself to say, "abandon ship, Charles Darwin has a better idea!" just a few weeks into Plan A.

I found Paleo in a fitness context, and one thing that appealed, both about the 'extreme fitness' wackos (please don't let them hurt me!) and the Paleo diet, was precisely the lack of moderation. Moderation in exercise, for me, is not working. And it never has - I used to dance (ever known a casual ballerina?). (Since re-embracing MC, my new fitness goal involves walking the dog - but I hope there will be a new form of happy movement coming soon.)

I have never seen why I should eat a "moderate amount" of something that cannot be classified into a food group. I don't know my complete list of intolerances yet, but I would rather just not eat a class of foods than try to make something that isn't an egg behave more like an egg. (Yeah, I know - easy to say that right now, and I'm sure I will run up against one uneatable item that breaks my heart.)

Let me qualify - I am quite the fan of moderation where it doesn't mean "doing something stupid/dangerous, but only a little bit." Moderating my temper? ALL FOR IT. Occasionally shutting up so others can speak? (OK, you can all stop laughing now.) Doing a little bit of puttering here and there instead of waiting till the house/laundry/dishes go to pieces and we have to spend all weekend recovering? Getting better at this all the time.

I feel lucky I've never used a lot of processed/prepared foods, and lucky that my husband is like-minded. I never drank soda (tried as a kid - though the bubbles in beer and champagne always seemed friendly, soda bubbles hurt). And I would never liked sweets enough to use splenda (or stevia). Even really fabulous chocolates - in NYC the Teuscher brand is flown in 2x/week from Switzerland, if you're well-heeled or crazy - I can adore rarely, in tiny quantities - or maybe now I'll learn to make my own rare treats. (And now you sweets-enjoyers know: when I post a recipe to Dee's Kitchen, run for the hills!)

If I had read about Paleo first, I would have done that instead of my own made-up "GF vegan" thing; but I was a walking time bomb either way, and would have been here sooner or later, whether it was that fateful tortilla or someone's birthday cake or a mystery food that got to me. I know that there is no way to know how "severe" my personal MC version is. The fact that I have had a lucky break of spontaneous remission does not mean I have incurred less damage, necessarily, or that I have a small number of intolerances, or - any other lucky thing. (More likely, my luck has run out - at least at some level.) I may turn out to have more intolerances now than I would, had I known originally to cut gluten absolutely, and dairy/soy/corn provisionally, and take an observant approach. I assume that from now on, remission will be sought and won, not tripped into, and I can live with that. Actually it's better than spinning the roulette wheel and hoping for another lucky break.

I do believe I can/should/will start down a Paleo path - and I hope once I am healed enough I can seriously up the veg. I've been a prodigious eater of raw veg all my life (people put out a salad for everyone, and I'm thinking, what are the rest of y'all gonna be having??). But I can cook my veg, if that's what works. I am a big fan of Real Food (yes, and slow food, local food, wild-gathered food, home-grown food...). My husband and I, years before we were a couple, would get together and EAT. We shopped at greenmarkets and bought more apples than we could comfortably carry, we went to interesting restaurants we could barely afford... gosh, I hope I can eat apples, but I don't think my marriage depends on it ;)

I know everyone must find their own path, and one size does not fit all, and what to me would be a minor loss (say, red velvet cake) would be a real blow to a pastry chef or master baker - I just hope each of us who's still seeking may find a road that works, soon, and for the long term.

Thanks again, Polly, for the nudge in the Paleo direction. It seems easier to me now than Elaine G's SCD book sounded when I read it during my first MC experience. I think it's a better fit for me - at least for now, and I'm sure once I get myself up and running with it, I won't be looking wistfully at what I'm missing.

I feel as though all my posts wind up far longer than they need to be (and you should see the stuff that hits the cutting room floor) - but at this stage I am finding it extraordinarily helpful to write/think it out.

Sara

P.S. Joe - saw your paleo thoughts, too. I thought rice was my friend (and I think last week it probably was helping me at least keep my weight from dropping too fast). Now I'm not so sure. It must have been a shock having one of your safe foods flagged that way. I think over time I will also get a more complete read on my food list via MRT/LEAP - but first things first for me. I will be interested to hear how you feel if you choose to cut back on rice.
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Polly
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Location: Maryland

PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 6:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arlene,

Good thinking. Sounds possible to me. Maybe Mary Beth knows if this ever happens?

Sara,

Will start another thread to to continue.

Love,

Polly
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mbeezie
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polly/Arlene,

I don't think that's the case, but I can't say for sure. I think more often than not it's contamination or hidden ingredients (soy, corn gluten etc) in the flour itself or in baking powder, vanilla, xanthan gum etc. Some grains, like millet and buckwheat, are almost always contaminated with gluten.

Mary Beth
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TooManyHats
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Food Intolerances : Gluten Soy Dairy Spices including cinnamon, cloves, and ginger
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If all the ingredients have been tested individually as safe, then why would the hidden ingredients only show up when they have been combined and baked into something?
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Polly
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Location: Maryland

PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mary Beth,

Do you know of any brand names for flours that are certified GF or that are processed in a safe facility?

Polly
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mbeezie
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe Bob's Red Mill has some . . .. but I will have to defer to Gloria, our resident flour expert. I have not investigated the grains very much because I try to avoid many of them.

Mary Beth
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TooManyHats
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 8:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
If all the ingredients have been tested individually as safe, then why would the hidden ingredients only show up when they have been combined and baked into something?


Unless people are switching brands of ingredients when they bake?
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Arlene

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mbeezie
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

How would one know about baking powder, since I don't know of another use for that other than baking? One must be sure to buy corn free baking powder.

I want to clarify that when I eat baked goods I don't necessarily get D, I just feel uncomfortbaly full and bloated. If you are gettind D then I have to think something you are ingesting is contaminated.

Mary Beth
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TooManyHats
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Maybe so, but I thought all was OK because I used the recipe for "safe" baking powder suggested in that recipe - in my case, I used 1 part baking soda (sodium bicarbonate), 1 part rice flour, and 2 parts cream of tartar (made only from grapes, which I have had no problem tolerating in any form - fruit, wine, balsamic vinegar, etc). Hmmmmm, a mystery.


Hmmmm....that is a mystery.
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Arlene

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Polly
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Location: Maryland

PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arlene,

You have an inquisitive mind - I can tell you do not leave any stone unturned when seeking an answer to a mystery. Good for you! Cool thumbs up I re-read this thread and realize I was misleading when I said that every ingredient was tested separately. In the case of the rice flour I was using, I did not mean I had specifically tested that flour before - actually I meant that I had tested rice, that I was OK with rice. I made the assumption that pure rice flour was equal to rice. Apparently it may not be, from what Mary Beth says. I am now thinking that contamination of flours may be a big issue. Sorry if I misled you or caused some unnecesary thinking! LOL! My bad.

Love,

Polly
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mbeezie
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Contamination of flours is a very big issue. Here is a recent article on the issue http://www.glutenfreedietitian.com/newsletter/c...uten-free-grains/

Mary Beth
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tex
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Location: Central Texas

PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As an old farm boy, that "discovery" fits quite well with that I have always known, (from first hand experience). There is no such thing as perfectly "clean" fields, perfectly "clean" trucks, harvesting equipment, storage and handling equipment, processing equipment, etc. By "clean", I mean containing a zero amount of cross contamination with other grains. In the real world, that's virtually impossible, and it's simply a pipe dream. Of course, merchandisers would prefer that everyone think differently, but anyone who has worked in many segments of the industry, all their life, should be well aware of the problems.

Everything certified as gluten-free, (and I mean everything), is low-gluten, not gluten-free. I can't think of a single exception, though there probably are a few isolated instances here and there. In general, though, it's safe to assume that nothing is truly GF.

Thanks for the link, Mary Beth. That's a great reference.

Tex
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sarkin
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That makes so much sense. The wind, the equipment... it's the proverbial needle-in-a-haystack problem. I recently (pre-MC resurfacing) had some fabulous rice from a small grower in Louisiana. He leaves in the smaller, reddish grains of wild rice that producers struggle to remove when selling to the big brands of long-grain rice. It's much easier for him, of course (not to mention less expensive), and attractive and tasty for them as likes such things. It's not a lot, by any means. But I can clearly see how impossible it would be to remove it, or any 'contaminant,' 100%.

I would guess that even brands that tested below 20ppm in the article Mary Beth shared would vary, according to time of year, or nature of what's grown by their suppliers nearby in one season versus another, or luck. Maybe some processors are better at controlling those parts of the equation that are within their control, but then there are all the other factors.

Food for thought!

Sara
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