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Tapering off of Budesonide should I add antihistimine?
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mwt
Little Blue Penguin
Little Blue Penguin
United States

Joined: 27 Dec 2015

Posts: 29
User's local time:
2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, dairy, sugar, soy

PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 10:01 am    Post subject: Follow up to Tapering Off Of Budesonide...WHAT NOW?? Reply with quote

TEX and GABE thank you both so much I will read/do all that you have suggested! I can't thank you both enough for the help you have given me!! I will post another follow up in 8 weeks off of Budesonide
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tex
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Joined: 24 May 2005

Posts: 30705
User's local time:
2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, casein, soy, and avenin, (avenin is the prolamin in oats, which is equivalent to the gluten in wheat), beef, grapes, peanuts, cashews, almonds, (but nut butters seem OK except for peanuts), citric acid, chocolate, and agar.
Location: Central Texas

PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thumbs up

You're most welcome.

Tex
_________________
cowboy

It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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mwt
Little Blue Penguin
Little Blue Penguin
United States

Joined: 27 Dec 2015

Posts: 29
User's local time:
2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, dairy, sugar, soy

PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 2:18 pm    Post subject: Follow up to Tapering Off Of Budesonide...WHAT NOW?? Reply with quote

Tex or Gabe

Also am I to assume that because the D has stopped since beginning the antihistamines that I DO have mast cell activation issues?

The reason that I'm asking is rereading the symptoms of Mast Cell issues I don't detect any problems after eating high histamine foods (except for a stuffy nose after drinking wine) and I have no seasonal allergies. This is just confusing!

Thanks again!
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tex
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Joined: 24 May 2005

Posts: 30705
User's local time:
2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, casein, soy, and avenin, (avenin is the prolamin in oats, which is equivalent to the gluten in wheat), beef, grapes, peanuts, cashews, almonds, (but nut butters seem OK except for peanuts), citric acid, chocolate, and agar.
Location: Central Texas

PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Probably, but the mast cell problems may only be a digestive system (mostly intestinal) issue. Nothing else may be affected and once you get things under control with your digestive system, mast cells may be irrelevant to your future health. At least that's what we hope is true.

In a nutshell, weaning off a corticosteroid causes a rebound in mast cell numbers which often triggers a reaction due to excess instances of histamine release. An antihistamine can block the H1 receptors, thus slowing the activity of the extra histamine in circulation. In addition, the intestines contain at least half the body's supply of serotonin in their enterochromaffin cells. Antidepressants sometimes stop D by altering the serotonin activity level in the intestines. Antidepressants are primarily powerful antihistamines. For safety reasons we use antihistamines instead of antidepressants to alter the activity level of serotonin in the gut. Sometimes it works as planned.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serotonin

Tex
_________________
cowboy

It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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brandy
Rockhopper Penguin
Rockhopper Penguin
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Joined: 16 Oct 2011

Posts: 1950
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2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : gluten, dairy, soy, corn, sugar, quinoa, rasberries, blackberries
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great news!

Quote:
My Question is WHAT NOW? How and when do I stop Antihistimines? What about diet, should I stay on this very restricted diet?


This is somewhat of a guess but I'd stay on the antihistamines at least 30 days maybe 45 after the last Entocort.
Cut back on dose if you get too "dry." The first one to eliminate would be the benedryl as it is anticholinergic drug--long term use is linked to alzheimers. Longterm would be something like 4 months or more....just don't stay on the benedryl forever etc.

Recommend start the Thorn Methyl Guard that Gabes talks about before stopping antihistamines.

Diet keep restricted for about 6-8 weeks after last Entocort. Slowly add things in after that. Slower is better when adding foods back. You don't want to go backwards with this disease.

Stay clear of raw foods for a good long while.

I don't have typical histamine reactions either.

Keep us posted, great results!
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Gabes-Apg
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Joined: 21 Dec 2009

Posts: 7192
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2017 Nov 18 - 11:02 AM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, Yeast, Caesin, Soy, salad/raw veges and fruit
Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia

PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

there are sort of two to three levels of mast cell issues

mild - which is mainly linked to excess histamine type symptoms that will resolve when you correct nutritional deficiencies such as Vit D3, B6 and magnesium
medium - that will improve vastly with Vit D3, B6 and magnesium but you may need some antihistamines here and there
major /chronic - that you may need ongoing medication long term.

if there is resolution of most symptoms with small doses of anti-histamines then I would say you have mild treatable issue.
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Gabes Ryan

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
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brandy
Rockhopper Penguin
Rockhopper Penguin
unknown IP

Joined: 16 Oct 2011

Posts: 1950
User's local time:
2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : gluten, dairy, soy, corn, sugar, quinoa, rasberries, blackberries
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought I would post that I'm taking 1 of the Thorne methyl guard per day. I think the label references 2 or 3 per day which would be a very high dose.
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mwt
Little Blue Penguin
Little Blue Penguin
United States

Joined: 27 Dec 2015

Posts: 29
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2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, dairy, sugar, soy

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

UPDATE:

Seven months now since tapering completely off Busdesonide by taking antihistimines (Claritin and occasionally Benydrl @ bedtime). Mostly having soft but formed BM every morning but I would say that 1 out of every 2 days my second BM of the day is D. So, am I better...yes but, what is with this 2nd and 3rd BM of the morning being D? And because of this, I am very reluctant to stop the Claritin. My diet is still VERY limited (GF, DF, no sugar, no grains, No raw veg, very little fruit)...I afraid to add anything.

Supplements are: Vitamin D3, Culturelle Probiotic, Folate, and occ. Multi vit/mineral. I do use MG spray a couple of times per day and still continuing 1 Claritin daily.

What am I missing? What next step can I add to improve my health? Why the D after the first normal BM?
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Gabes-Apg
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Joined: 21 Dec 2009

Posts: 7192
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2017 Nov 18 - 11:02 AM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, Yeast, Caesin, Soy, salad/raw veges and fruit
Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From the experience of others here that have histamine issues, the key to resolving excess histamine is Magnesium and B6. and having the B6 in the active form.
this tends to be key for females as hormone issues deplete magnesium and B6.

regarding the diet, have you had entorolab testing to confirm triggers? if not have you tried going egg free, soy free?
are you 100% certain that you are not getting any exposure to gluten?
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Gabes Ryan

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
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mwt
Little Blue Penguin
Little Blue Penguin
United States

Joined: 27 Dec 2015

Posts: 29
User's local time:
2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, dairy, sugar, soy

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Gabe thanks so very much for replying!

Absolutely NO exposure to Gluten (I am also a registered Dietitian my household is GF 3 of us have Celiac) I follow a Paleo diet so I am eating very clean and nothing from a box or premade. I am currently avoiding eggs ( for probably 1 month now) and absolutely NO soy. What is so curious to me is the 2nd or 3rd BM usually not the 1st of the morning...and then by 9-10a.m. I have no more all day.

What brand or type of active B6 do you recommend? I have tried the ReMag (on your suggestion) before and had too much diarrhea. Although that was well over 1 year ago. I guess I'm just scared to try it again and that's why I'm doing some sprays and occasional Epsom slats bath.
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Gabes-Apg
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Food Intolerances : Gluten, Yeast, Caesin, Soy, salad/raw veges and fruit
Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

how much elemental magnesium are you getting via the sprays and epsom salt foot soaks.
are you getting a minimum of 400mg elemental magnesium per day??

For the active B6 - Thorne P5P is a very good option, along with this Thorne Methyl Guard plus is a good option as the essential active B's

here is a recent post from ERica about her histamine/methylation issues and how magnesium and active B's, with extra P5P helped her page 2 top post
http://perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=22706&start=15
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Gabes Ryan

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
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tex
Site Admin
Site Admin


Joined: 24 May 2005

Posts: 30705
User's local time:
2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, casein, soy, and avenin, (avenin is the prolamin in oats, which is equivalent to the gluten in wheat), beef, grapes, peanuts, cashews, almonds, (but nut butters seem OK except for peanuts), citric acid, chocolate, and agar.
Location: Central Texas

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mwt,

Are you sure the Culturelle isn't causing your problems? I think I would try skipping it a day or two.

Tex
_________________
cowboy

It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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mwt
Little Blue Penguin
Little Blue Penguin
United States

Joined: 27 Dec 2015

Posts: 29
User's local time:
2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, dairy, sugar, soy

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Gabe and Tex

No I'm definitely not getting 400mg of Magnesium. I've ordered the supplement that you recommended. I will look at the post that you recommended, Gabe

And Tex, I have stopped the probiotic for a month or more at a time and a couple of times...no difference noted.

Thank you all again!
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tex
Site Admin
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Joined: 24 May 2005

Posts: 30705
User's local time:
2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, casein, soy, and avenin, (avenin is the prolamin in oats, which is equivalent to the gluten in wheat), beef, grapes, peanuts, cashews, almonds, (but nut butters seem OK except for peanuts), citric acid, chocolate, and agar.
Location: Central Texas

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, if the Culturelle doesn't cause any diarrhea, it may help. Have you tried taking a different antihistamine? Like maybe trying Allegra in place of the Claritin.

Tex
_________________
cowboy

It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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mwt
Little Blue Penguin
Little Blue Penguin
United States

Joined: 27 Dec 2015

Posts: 29
User's local time:
2017 Nov 17 - 7:02 PM


Food Intolerances : Gluten, dairy, sugar, soy

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tex

I just assumed all of the antihistamines were "created equal" I will try Allegra. Thanks so much for the suggestion!
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